$txt['mentions'] = 'Mentions'; $txt['scheduled_task_removeMentions'] = 'Remove seen mentions'; $txt['scheduled_task_desc_removeMentions'] = 'Automatically removes seen mentions older than the specified days'; Pundits League October Bonus Game

Author Topic: Pundits League October Bonus Game  (Read 2105 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Online avinastella

  • A little respect please...
  • ******
  • Posts: 2658
    • View Profile
Re: Pundits League October Bonus Game
« Reply #30 on: October 10, 2018, 10:04:07 AM »
With all the comments about cups/leagues and teams not wanting to play/can't be bothered, i'm surprised no one has commented on this thread yet:
http://yorkshirerugby.net/index.php?topic=10230.0#new

A solution has to be found to appease that lot over the Pennines but it looks like the default position of the panel is to try and impose their previous aims - 12 team leagues, cup matches based around a National comp (in a mini regional format etc)
Most worryingly is the interest in leagues running cross county border.
Now is the time to speak up before it is too late.

To put cup games into perspective. At least 11 walkovers last weekend.
"Bother!" said Pooh, as he found his smack had talc in it.

Offline Thread Killer

  • One of the boys
  • *
  • Posts: 175
    • View Profile
Re: Pundits League October Bonus Game
« Reply #31 on: October 11, 2018, 12:37:12 PM »
All views my own etc.

Not expecting this to be universally popular, and it’s admittedly coming from the perspectives of player retention/recruitment and the lower half/two-thirds of the Leagues, but the structure of the season needs to change drastically if the slide in playing numbers is to be halted. Some imagination is required, alongside a recognition that maintaining the status quo of 14-team Leagues equates to taking the same option when something is clearly not working, a definition of insanity.

The days of most players playing every week between the start of September and early May have gone. The majority of people on this Forum and involved in running their clubs and the Game as a whole (another facet of the problem), played when this wasn’t the case and resent/can’t understand why this has changed. I’m afraid it’s time to embrace the horror. 18-30 year olds now have infinitely more distractions and demands on their weekends (including getting married & having Stag Dos during the season!) from partners, family and work.

It’s time for some radical, evolved thinking as to what Saturday Rugby needs to mean to appeal to existing players & watchers and attract new ones. The solution lies in drastically fewer league games below National League level. An unremitting diet of 26, 80-minute league games a year, with minimal season to season variation in opposition, out of the 30 weeks available is just too one-dimensional and out of date and leaves ZERO room for anything else once weather has forced rearranged fixtures.

At “Social Rugby” level, and the crucial point is where in the League structure you draw that line, 18 league games a year to give the season it’s basic structure is enough. The key to engagement lies in being creative with the balance of the year. A mixture of tours, mini-tours, friendlies, 3-way fixtures, long-lost local derbies, half-pitch tag tournaments, 10s festivals, open days to engage local communities, early kick-offs on International weekends, mixed touch tournaments, family days, yes maybe County Cups and even… whisper it, the odd week off; whatever floats your boat and gives players, wives, girlfriends, kids and families enough variety to make “Saturday afternoon down the Rugby Club” a more interesting, attractive and inclusive offer.

As I understand it, last time round, the argument against the reduction from 14-12 team leagues (Which was the RFU’s preferred choice and recommendation nationally, having spent a 6 or maybe 7 figure sum on a consultation, it was only a Yorkshire/Northern Cadre that dug their heels in and stamped their feet until the RFU capitulated) was the assertion that “we can’t afford to lose the revenue from those 2 home games.” Not my place to tell others how to run their clubs but I’d suggest that if that 2-game marginal revenue is that important, and particularly if that revenue is in envelopes going round a changing room below National League level, then you’re borderline unsustainable already.

It’s obviously not wrong, indeed it’s essential, that many clubs are upwardly mobile, and if, to this end, they want to pay players and have 26-30 League Games a Year to fund that then that’s absolutely fine. Aspirational clubs would still be able to force their way out of “Social” rugby and up the structure over a period of time if they wanted to, and could afford it. I’m speaking from the perspective of those clubs who don’t see themselves as the next Exeter, Doncaster, or even West Leeds, but want to perpetuate the playing of Rugby as a mostly social, recreational, enjoyable, amateur endeavour and provide the same to as many as possible who share that aspiration. There’s more of us than you’d think!

The crux is, where is the line below which smaller leagues might be appropriate? My feel is that its Y1 and down. Others will no doubt feel differently.

I’m also not naïve enough to think much of the above is going to be adopted quickly, if at all; but a reduction in League size in 2019-20 from 14 to 12 in Y1, and 10-team Leagues at Y2 and below would be a start.

Online avinastella

  • A little respect please...
  • ******
  • Posts: 2658
    • View Profile
Re: Pundits League October Bonus Game
« Reply #32 on: October 11, 2018, 12:54:13 PM »
Quote
At “Social Rugby” level, and the crucial point is where in the League structure you draw that line, 18 league games a year to give the season it’s basic structure is enough. The key to engagement lies in being creative with the balance of the year. A mixture of tours, mini-tours, friendlies, 3-way fixtures, long-lost local derbies, half-pitch tag tournaments, 10s festivals, open days to engage local communities, early kick-offs on International weekends, mixed touch tournaments, family days, yes maybe County Cups and even… whisper it, the odd week off; whatever floats your boat and gives players, wives, girlfriends, kids and families enough variety to make “Saturday afternoon down the Rugby Club” a more interesting, attractive and inclusive offer.

Doesn't that pretty much take you back up to the current situation with regard to number of games.
Difference is many of them would be meaningless.

Valid points but running a club without a good structure of games would be even more difficult than it is now.
"Bother!" said Pooh, as he found his smack had talc in it.

Online North Coach

  • Finding my feet
  • Posts: 1
    • View Profile
Re: Pundits League October Bonus Game
« Reply #33 on: October 11, 2018, 02:14:10 PM »
Hi, Always watching but never post but this grabbed my attention.

For me personally I think people need to stop looking at the leagues and cups to resolve the issue of essential managing players and a club. At North we have always stood strong on not paying players and that no one player is better than a team. For me personally I would rather field 18 lads that have trained and make themselves available regularly than just putting the best players in. I have found that by doing this we now have a strong club rather than a 1st team and the so called star players now if they want to player have to put the same amount of commitment and hard work in as everyone else. I personally enjoy the current set up of the league and cup and look forward to all the games. If clubs can’t coupe with the amount of fixtures and players going off and doing other things then maybe it’s time to reward the players that are there and if that means dropping in league levels then so be it. If teams are just going to give a walkover in the cup then why enter at all in the first place? If the excuse is to many first to players going and doing something else then reward the lads who make the effort to be there at the club to play in not only that game but the regular season games. We do have to accept the odd disappearance here and there as it is social level but to try and lessen the league and cup by taking away from what it currently is isn’t the solution for me personally. Reward the guys who train and play regularly and hope to build off them and that others will change their mindset to fit in with that of the club.

Again just my opinion.
All the best to all teams this weekend.

Offline Thread Killer

  • One of the boys
  • *
  • Posts: 175
    • View Profile
Re: Pundits League October Bonus Game
« Reply #34 on: October 11, 2018, 02:17:13 PM »
Quote
At “Social Rugby” level, and the crucial point is where in the League structure you draw that line, 18 league games a year to give the season it’s basic structure is enough. The key to engagement lies in being creative with the balance of the year. A mixture of tours, mini-tours, friendlies, 3-way fixtures, long-lost local derbies, half-pitch tag tournaments, 10s festivals, open days to engage local communities, early kick-offs on International weekends, mixed touch tournaments, family days, yes maybe County Cups and even… whisper it, the odd week off; whatever floats your boat and gives players, wives, girlfriends, kids and families enough variety to make “Saturday afternoon down the Rugby Club” a more interesting, attractive and inclusive offer.

Doesn't that pretty much take you back up to the current situation with regard to number of games.
Difference is many of them would be meaningless.

Valid points but running a club without a good structure of games would be even more difficult than it is now.

Think broader.

Yes, obviously “The current situation”, in that there’s Rugby of some sort going on at the Club every week of the season.

Just because it’s not a League game doesn’t make it “meaningless”. You could argue that for most clubs in the middle of a 14-team League, most League fixtures from mid-November onwards, when it’s pretty clear you’re not really in the mix for promotion or relegation, are “meaningless”.

A Memorial Friendly for a past player/official against a local rival, or even internally,  which reconnects his contemporaries and other past players with the Club, (maybe turns them into VPs?) has more “meaning” than some mid-table skirmish which might have a bearing on whether we finish 6th or 7th this year.

10 team Leagues still gives you 60/70% fixed part of the season around which you add variety, giving you the “good structure” you refer to, and making the season more varied, interesting and attractive.

Any change is "more difficult", but no change, which seems to be the suggestion, is the current slow decline into oblivion.