Yorkshire Rugby

The sad truth is that many clubs are in dire straights. However demographics are a major reason. Too many clubs with small catchment due to being co located.
Also some clubs have not put in the effort to generate players. My club has run minis and juniors for nearly 40 years. That's thousands of manhours of effort by volunteers, coaches and players. The rewards of which have been  other clubs often poaching young players with chance of league rugby instead of putting the hard yards in. 2xvs in league would help retain them and offering them the same in the 2xv at their club.
No right minded club would resent lads trying to test themselves at a higher level, we are very proud of the players who have gone on to bigger stages, we also welcome them back.

We need to do something different, we are currently losing 5% adult male players per annum, the status quo will not turn that round.

Clubs that fear they could lose players need to make their club attractive to ensure retention. Offering league rugby, training facilities, family friendly clubhouse, junior section, girls and ladies etc.

In parts of the country where 2xvs play in leagues the demise of clubs has been no greater than in the North.

Quote from: Locked Out on Mar 18, 2026, 03:59 PMI was trying to be diplomatic! Also really miss the highly entertaining banter on here from the likes of Beachy, Bez, Chez and the immortal Hoodie.

I miss my weekly banter posts too Locked Art, ahh those were the days. I hope Mud Pig is still around somewhere sunning himself on a beach.

But in all seriousness I have to agree with a lot of points on this thread, it's been a slow but consistent demise for many small community clubs in the north and it only seems to be going one way. Season after season you see one or two more old historic teams dropping from the leagues and either going to the merit leagues or just dropping out altogether, which can't be good for growing the game. Soon enough it will be a selection of 'big' clubs running multiple teams in a union super league. You only have to look at the Premiership now with 10 teams and dare I say that won't be increasing anytime soon.

It's ok though because the all knowing oracle Bill Sweeney's at the helm and he really knows what he's doing. Metaphorical car driving off a cliff comes to mind...

Quote from: Ribbflagman on Mar 18, 2026, 10:11 PMGateprop,
           it appears that Pythons are still in the merit league despite (this Saturday against us) giving at least four walkovers. I know Knottingley are struggling along with several other clubs due a multitude of problems. If you think that they should be "De-Merited" for want of better terminology. Just wait until the big clubs get their way and get second XVs into the league system and some of the following clubs (just a snapshot imho) future will be in jeopardy due to their proximity to (larger clubs.) . Knottingley(Pontefract)  will be merely the tip of the Iceberg with clubs like. Rowntrees, York RI, (York) Hornsea, Withernsea (Ionians/Brid) Hemsworth (Ponte), Stocksbridge, Barnsley ,Sheffield Oaks, (Sheffield/Tigers). Skipton. (Wharfedale/Ribb/Keighley) Burley, Aireborough, Modernians, Corinthians, (Morley/Yarnbury/Moortown) Rodillians, Ossett (Sandal), Pythons, Knaresborough, (Harrogate) To name but a few. Could be in peril.
I know that the post is a bit muddled but if we really DO NOT care about the aforementioned clubs (not in brackets) potentially folding then we have tunnel vision as, what has gone around has until now generally come around and clubs success or otherwise tended to be cyclical depending on personnel etc.
I know my feelings on what the RFU think of it all. BUT do WE want to be the catalysts to the shrinking of our game and see a further demise in our member clubs as has happened in Yorkshire these last Forty years when clubs like Wakefield ,Roundhay, Headingley, Yorkshire Copperworks, Adwick le street. Leeds CSSA, Leeds YMCA, and many colliery teams and others have been lost forever.
I personally feel sad that strong clubs are Jockeying for position to deliver a fatal blow to some long established clubs.
I know that clubs mentioned above may or may not share my concern about their future, ,either positively or negatively one way or the other and it is only my opinion, but in these uncertain times I just wanted to voice my concerns for some of the lower clubs survival.

Correct me here Ribb, but I believe next season 2XV's will be entering the Yorkshire leagues. Cant say I agree with it because when these 2XV sides come up against established sides with old heads in they will soon go missing.

If our 3XV carry on we will be dropping out of the league and going to two games a month at best, people just aren't bothered for it anymore. There's plenty of reasons why but the glaring one for me is the amount of clubs that have become narrowed visioned in their approach to anything outside of the 1XV. We have been lucky at Ilkley in that we have people that have run themselves into the floor in the effort to engage and roll out three sides,  this season we have seen a drop off in interest though.

When I see how you celebrate ALL of your players at Ribb its no wonder you have had the success you have had in that people take pride in representing the 2's and not just the 1's. That club house is packed whenever we have faced you.

Which second teams will be joining ? Will they be starting in Y4 ?

Quote from: Rob13 on Mar 19, 2026, 02:01 PM

Quote from: Ribbflagman on Mar 18, 2026, 10:11 PMGateprop,
           it appears that Pythons are still in the merit league despite (this Saturday against us) giving at least four walkovers. I know Knottingley are struggling along with several other clubs due a multitude of problems. If you think that they should be "De-Merited" for want of better terminology. Just wait until the big clubs get their way and get second XVs into the league system and some of the following clubs (just a snapshot imho) future will be in jeopardy due to their proximity to (larger clubs.) . Knottingley(Pontefract)  will be merely the tip of the Iceberg with clubs like. Rowntrees, York RI, (York) Hornsea, Withernsea (Ionians/Brid) Hemsworth (Ponte), Stocksbridge, Barnsley ,Sheffield Oaks, (Sheffield/Tigers). Skipton. (Wharfedale/Ribb/Keighley) Burley, Aireborough, Modernians, Corinthians, (Morley/Yarnbury/Moortown) Rodillians, Ossett (Sandal), Pythons, Knaresborough, (Harrogate) To name but a few. Could be in peril.
I know that the post is a bit muddled but if we really DO NOT care about the aforementioned clubs (not in brackets) potentially folding then we have tunnel vision as, what has gone around has until now generally come around and clubs success or otherwise tended to be cyclical depending on personnel etc.
I know my feelings on what the RFU think of it all. BUT do WE want to be the catalysts to the shrinking of our game and see a further demise in our member clubs as has happened in Yorkshire these last Forty years when clubs like Wakefield ,Roundhay, Headingley, Yorkshire Copperworks, Adwick le street. Leeds CSSA, Leeds YMCA, and many colliery teams and others have been lost forever.
I personally feel sad that strong clubs are Jockeying for position to deliver a fatal blow to some long established clubs.
I know that clubs mentioned above may or may not share my concern about their future, ,either positively or negatively one way or the other and it is only my opinion, but in these uncertain times I just wanted to voice my concerns for some of the lower clubs survival.

Correct me here Ribb, but I believe next season 2XV's will be entering the Yorkshire leagues. Cant say I agree with it because when these 2XV sides come up against established sides with old heads in they will soon go missing.

If our 3XV carry on we will be dropping out of the league and going to two games a month at best, people just aren't bothered for it anymore. There's plenty of reasons why but the glaring one for me is the amount of clubs that have become narrowed visioned in their approach to anything outside of the 1XV. We have been lucky at Ilkley in that we have people that have run themselves into the floor in the effort to engage and roll out three sides,  this season we have seen a drop off in interest though.

When I see how you celebrate ALL of your players at Ribb its no wonder you have had the success you have had in that people take pride in representing the 2's and not just the 1's. That club house is packed whenever we have faced you.

I don't believe that has been agreed yet.

It certainly the case that some clubs are in favor of it, we are not currently one of them.

Quote from: Ribbflagman on Mar 18, 2026, 10:11 PMGateprop,
           it appears that Pythons are still in the merit league despite (this Saturday against us) giving at least four walkovers. I know Knottingley are struggling along with several other clubs due a multitude of problems. If you think that they should be "De-Merited" for want of better terminology. Just wait until the big clubs get their way and get second XVs into the league system and some of the following clubs (just a snapshot imho) future will be in jeopardy due to their proximity to (larger clubs.) . Knottingley(Pontefract)  will be merely the tip of the Iceberg with clubs like. Rowntrees, York RI, (York) Hornsea, Withernsea (Ionians/Brid) Hemsworth (Ponte), Stocksbridge, Barnsley ,Sheffield Oaks, (Sheffield/Tigers). Skipton. (Wharfedale/Ribb/Keighley) Burley, Aireborough, Modernians, Corinthians, (Morley/Yarnbury/Moortown) Rodillians, Ossett (Sandal), Pythons, Knaresborough, (Harrogate) To name but a few. Could be in peril.
I know that the post is a bit muddled but if we really DO NOT care about the aforementioned clubs (not in brackets) potentially folding then we have tunnel vision as, what has gone around has until now generally come around and clubs success or otherwise tended to be cyclical depending on personnel etc.
I know my feelings on what the RFU think of it all. BUT do WE want to be the catalysts to the shrinking of our game and see a further demise in our member clubs as has happened in Yorkshire these last Forty years when clubs like Wakefield ,Roundhay, Headingley, Yorkshire Copperworks, Adwick le street. Leeds CSSA, Leeds YMCA, and many colliery teams and others have been lost forever.
I personally feel sad that strong clubs are Jockeying for position to deliver a fatal blow to some long established clubs.
I know that clubs mentioned above may or may not share my concern about their future, ,either positively or negatively one way or the other and it is only my opinion, but in these uncertain times I just wanted to voice my concerns for some of the lower clubs survival.

I'll be honest, I don't know the situation of our 2nd XV at the moment. I know we've been in discussions with the YRFU all season trying to be as honest as possible about where we're at. I get it has to be incredibly frustrating for a team like Ribb where I guess a lot of teams will take a home fixture but not reciprocate. I've travelled across to Ribb with 10 players in a 2nd XV before but the reality is that some players just aren't interested in doing that.

I don't know what the solution is but I'd suggest there's an argument for expanding the Yorkshire Premiership to 12 teams from 7 with the best of the West/East Championship teams. Then pulling up teams like North Ribb from the lower merit leagues into the West/East champs where fixture fulfilment seems to be a lot more reliable.

For example you could have:

Yorkshire Premiership - 12 teams
Sheffield 2nd XV
Hull Ionians  2nd XV
Sandal 2nd XV
Wharfedale 2nd XV
Ilkley 2nd XV
Driffield 2nd XV
Sheffield Tigers 2nd XV
Heath 2nd XV
Harrogate 2nd XV
Huddersfield 2nd XV
Malton & Norton 2nd XV
Selby 2nd XV

East Championship - 10 teams
Pocklington 2nd XV
Hullensians 2nd XV
Driffield 3rd XV
Scarborough 2nd XV
Pontefract 2nd XV
BP Chemicals
Barton & District
Scunthorpe 3rd XV
Malton & Norton 3rd XV
Hull Ionians 3rd XV

West Championship - 12 teams
Wath 2nd XV
Wetherby 2nd XV
Morley 2nd XV
Moortown 2nd XV
Keighley 2nd XV
Cleckheaton 2nd XV
Old Brodleians 2nd XV
North Ribblesdale 2nd XV
Yarnbury 2nd XV
Sheffield Oaks
Dinnington 2nd XV
Sheffield Engineers 2nd XV

This is all a little bit fantasy manager but just a way I can see of rebalancing the merit leagues based on current league positions and fixture fulfilment. This is obviously not accounting for if 2nd XV's are then taken out of the merit league to go into the Yorkshire Leagues.

I don't believe that has been agreed yet.

It certainly the case that some clubs are in favor of it, we are not currently one of them.
[/quote]
It hasn't. RFU Competitions committee are trying to railroad Yorkshire into ignoring the vote we had and just bring it in.
They claim Yorkshire let them down as one of the Council Members told them the vote would be in favour of it.
Steve Grainger was told last week that it might be fine for Cornwall with only 17 clubs but it would be a disaster for clubs up here.

Quote from: backrowbandit on Mar 19, 2026, 02:56 PM

Quote from: Rob13 on Mar 19, 2026, 02:01 PM

Quote from: Ribbflagman on Mar 18, 2026, 10:11 PMGateprop,
           it appears that Pythons are still in the merit league despite (this Saturday against us) giving at least four walkovers. I know Knottingley are struggling along with several other clubs due a multitude of problems. If you think that they should be "De-Merited" for want of better terminology. Just wait until the big clubs get their way and get second XVs into the league system and some of the following clubs (just a snapshot imho) future will be in jeopardy due to their proximity to (larger clubs.) . Knottingley(Pontefract)  will be merely the tip of the Iceberg with clubs like. Rowntrees, York RI, (York) Hornsea, Withernsea (Ionians/Brid) Hemsworth (Ponte), Stocksbridge, Barnsley ,Sheffield Oaks, (Sheffield/Tigers). Skipton. (Wharfedale/Ribb/Keighley) Burley, Aireborough, Modernians, Corinthians, (Morley/Yarnbury/Moortown) Rodillians, Ossett (Sandal), Pythons, Knaresborough, (Harrogate) To name but a few. Could be in peril.
I know that the post is a bit muddled but if we really DO NOT care about the aforementioned clubs (not in brackets) potentially folding then we have tunnel vision as, what has gone around has until now generally come around and clubs success or otherwise tended to be cyclical depending on personnel etc.
I know my feelings on what the RFU think of it all. BUT do WE want to be the catalysts to the shrinking of our game and see a further demise in our member clubs as has happened in Yorkshire these last Forty years when clubs like Wakefield ,Roundhay, Headingley, Yorkshire Copperworks, Adwick le street. Leeds CSSA, Leeds YMCA, and many colliery teams and others have been lost forever.
I personally feel sad that strong clubs are Jockeying for position to deliver a fatal blow to some long established clubs.
I know that clubs mentioned above may or may not share my concern about their future, ,either positively or negatively one way or the other and it is only my opinion, but in these uncertain times I just wanted to voice my concerns for some of the lower clubs survival.

Correct me here Ribb, but I believe next season 2XV's will be entering the Yorkshire leagues. Cant say I agree with it because when these 2XV sides come up against established sides with old heads in they will soon go missing.

If our 3XV carry on we will be dropping out of the league and going to two games a month at best, people just aren't bothered for it anymore. There's plenty of reasons why but the glaring one for me is the amount of clubs that have become narrowed visioned in their approach to anything outside of the 1XV. We have been lucky at Ilkley in that we have people that have run themselves into the floor in the effort to engage and roll out three sides,  this season we have seen a drop off in interest though.

When I see how you celebrate ALL of your players at Ribb its no wonder you have had the success you have had in that people take pride in representing the 2's and not just the 1's. That club house is packed whenever we have faced you.

I don't believe that has been agreed yet.

It certainly the case that some clubs are in favor of it, we are not currently one of them.

Not currently one of them, however Scarborough 2s have had some rather comprehensive results in recent weeks and are seeing what a competitive 1st XV does for the 2s. With 1st team quality players filling the shirts for the 2nd team to fight for a 1st team place, how long can you keep these players happy, and 1st team ready playing against the likes of Barton or BP Chemicals? No disrespect meant at all to those clubs playing in the merit leagues, but a 1st team standard players who has aspirations of playing at level 5 next season, wont benefit for to long playing those fixtures. Are the next crop of Scarborough talent able to demonstrate that they are ready for level 5 rugby playing against Driffield 3rd Team?

For clubs who's 2nd XV are playing in a league with only 6 other sides, has only played 9 competitive league fixtures all season and had to travel to Alnwick and Ilkley away twice for friendlies then it might seem appealing.

2nd XVs entering into the Yorkshire Pyramid isn't going to be the end of rugby as we know it our region. People need to be more open minded to it, what might not suit your club at the moment, could be the making of them in years to come. If the only way to keep hold of players is to offer them competitive league rugby, then it will quickly seem like a no brainer.

I don't buy in on the bigger clubs 2nd/3rd teams take players away from smaller clubs. I know plenty of players who play 2nds because it more relaxed and they just want to enjoy the rugby. Take Driffield for example then can put 4 teams out most weeks. If they got rid of the 3rd and 4th team how many of those players would go to the smaller clubs around them ? I would say Very few.

Everyone has their opinion and who knows how things may or may not end up. My only concern was a genuine one that, if I am right, several clubs will be lost forever and never to return. I may be very wrong, BUT, if I am proved to be right  with the test of time. Will the bigger clubs/beneficiaries feel any regret  or even support such clubs by potentially lending players, as they may be striving to survive. I honestly dont think so. In most instances (with perhaps the exception of Scarbs) I personally think not. Bunker mentality usually ensues when the waters get choppy and the bigger clubs will happily let other clubs "Wither on the vine" and then take advantage for their own gain/preservation.
Again only my opinion but it really would be a shame if clubs like Knottingley fold. It was never our favourite place to visit, but but it was always challenging to say the least. And despite the challenges we were always very made welcome.

Quote from: Differ Lid on Mar 20, 2026, 11:36 AM

Quote from: backrowbandit on Mar 19, 2026, 02:56 PM

Quote from: Rob13 on Mar 19, 2026, 02:01 PM

Quote from: Ribbflagman on Mar 18, 2026, 10:11 PMGateprop,
           it appears that Pythons are still in the merit league despite (this Saturday against us) giving at least four walkovers. I know Knottingley are struggling along with several other clubs due a multitude of problems. If you think that they should be "De-Merited" for want of better terminology. Just wait until the big clubs get their way and get second XVs into the league system and some of the following clubs (just a snapshot imho) future will be in jeopardy due to their proximity to (larger clubs.) . Knottingley(Pontefract)  will be merely the tip of the Iceberg with clubs like. Rowntrees, York RI, (York) Hornsea, Withernsea (Ionians/Brid) Hemsworth (Ponte), Stocksbridge, Barnsley ,Sheffield Oaks, (Sheffield/Tigers). Skipton. (Wharfedale/Ribb/Keighley) Burley, Aireborough, Modernians, Corinthians, (Morley/Yarnbury/Moortown) Rodillians, Ossett (Sandal), Pythons, Knaresborough, (Harrogate) To name but a few. Could be in peril.
I know that the post is a bit muddled but if we really DO NOT care about the aforementioned clubs (not in brackets) potentially folding then we have tunnel vision as, what has gone around has until now generally come around and clubs success or otherwise tended to be cyclical depending on personnel etc.
I know my feelings on what the RFU think of it all. BUT do WE want to be the catalysts to the shrinking of our game and see a further demise in our member clubs as has happened in Yorkshire these last Forty years when clubs like Wakefield ,Roundhay, Headingley, Yorkshire Copperworks, Adwick le street. Leeds CSSA, Leeds YMCA, and many colliery teams and others have been lost forever.
I personally feel sad that strong clubs are Jockeying for position to deliver a fatal blow to some long established clubs.
I know that clubs mentioned above may or may not share my concern about their future, ,either positively or negatively one way or the other and it is only my opinion, but in these uncertain times I just wanted to voice my concerns for some of the lower clubs survival.

Correct me here Ribb, but I believe next season 2XV's will be entering the Yorkshire leagues. Cant say I agree with it because when these 2XV sides come up against established sides with old heads in they will soon go missing.

If our 3XV carry on we will be dropping out of the league and going to two games a month at best, people just aren't bothered for it anymore. There's plenty of reasons why but the glaring one for me is the amount of clubs that have become narrowed visioned in their approach to anything outside of the 1XV. We have been lucky at Ilkley in that we have people that have run themselves into the floor in the effort to engage and roll out three sides,  this season we have seen a drop off in interest though.

When I see how you celebrate ALL of your players at Ribb its no wonder you have had the success you have had in that people take pride in representing the 2's and not just the 1's. That club house is packed whenever we have faced you.

I don't believe that has been agreed yet.

It certainly the case that some clubs are in favor of it, we are not currently one of them.

Not currently one of them, however Scarborough 2s have had some rather comprehensive results in recent weeks and are seeing what a competitive 1st XV does for the 2s. With 1st team quality players filling the shirts for the 2nd team to fight for a 1st team place, how long can you keep these players happy, and 1st team ready playing against the likes of Barton or BP Chemicals? No disrespect meant at all to those clubs playing in the merit leagues, but a 1st team standard players who has aspirations of playing at level 5 next season, wont benefit for to long playing those fixtures. Are the next crop of Scarborough talent able to demonstrate that they are ready for level 5 rugby playing against Driffield 3rd Team?

For clubs who's 2nd XV are playing in a league with only 6 other sides, has only played 9 competitive league fixtures all season and had to travel to Alnwick and Ilkley away twice for friendlies then it might seem appealing.

2nd XVs entering into the Yorkshire Pyramid isn't going to be the end of rugby as we know it our region. People need to be more open minded to it, what might not suit your club at the moment, could be the making of them in years to come. If the only way to keep hold of players is to offer them competitive league rugby, then it will quickly seem like a no brainer.

Er...if our 2nd team progressed they could play, lets say, Driffield 2nds in the merit league. It doesn't seem too complicated?